Defeatism
 

Anyone else tired of kids that complain about their situation and propose to water down the Dream Act instead of proposing good ways to help push it through, even in these now somewhat favorable time after the last election?

Discuss.

Re: Defeatism
 

It is not the defeatist attitude. The fact of the matter is that we need the senators on board. If one of them dislike the bill, they can kill it with filibusters. In order to stop that from happening, we need to get them on board. This would mean the need to possibly water it down to the bare essentials that focus on legalization. Unless Durbin and Reid can give them certain "freebies" to get them on board for the original bill, I think it would be somewhat difficult to pass a Dream Act that's filled with citizenship, financial aid, etc. At this point, I'd just be grateful for legalization and a green card. ANYTHING that legalizes us is good enough. I just want to stay in this country and I'm not interested in getting help for college or anything like that.

Let's face it, certain conservative Republicans AND Democrats aren't going to agree to the bill, especially with the current global economic crisis, job losses, the unemployment rate going up, energy indepedence... The list goes on. Immigration is not going to be the number one priority. Even Rahm Emanuel said so, however discouraging that may be. This is one the reasons that I think the American system is deeply flawed. It takes FOREVER to get a bill through and that's why only about 400 out of 10,000 bills ever become law.

We as Dreamers can't push it through alone. We need to get those politicians on board to help vote on it. I think we'll have no problem with the House of Representatives. We need to get people to know the truth about Dream and we need organizations to help us.

Now I'm confident that Dream will be introduced again in 2009. Maybe some of us with the time and money can go see Dick Durbin and actually talk to him? With the Democrats getting much greater control in the House and Senate, I'm sure it can go through easily. Last time was close, and 2009 will be closer. We can get a few Republicans to swing our way. With Obama actually talking about Dream in one of his debates, it seems like a reality that Dream could very well pass next year.

Re: Defeatism
 

1) I think UnMa's point was that we're being a bit presumptious about conceding provisions a bit to prematurely. We should be working on lobbying those persuadables by giving them good reasons to back up the provisions already written within the bill, not trying to figure out how to write the bill.

2) You aren't going to persuade a Sessions, Vitter, DeMint and co. from filibustering the DREAM Act, no matter what, it'll always be amnesty to them. DREAM is always going to have a filibusteree.

3) WE DO NOT QUALIFY FOR FINANCIAL AID!!! I repeat, WE DO NOT QUALIFY FOR FINANCIAL AID under the DREAM Act. And furthermore, as soon as DREAM as signed, we don't just magically get granted citizenship on the spot. PLEASE READ THE BILL before suggesting amendments to it.

4) Then we should stick to lobbying for it and convincing why the bill in it's present form is acceptable and fair to us.

You're right btw, no one is advocating a defeatist attitude, but some people are sure acting like gutless cowards full of hopeless fear, when we just got a gift securing a POTUS that supports us and increasing our majority lead in both chambers.

Re: Defeatism
 

I am well aware of the no financial aid part, I was just pointing out that things like that could really kill the bill. We don't need people like Sessions, Vitter, DeMint, and co. I think if Harry Reid calls their bluff, it could very well backfire on the senators who do filibusters. Make them stand there 24/7 for as long as they like. However, this is unlikely to happen because I just don't think the politicians care about us THAT much. As for the citizenship, I think it's safe to say that Dream would be more palatable if we just stick to permanent residency status.

Re: Defeatism
 

Well said, Citi.

Re: Defeatism
 

Exactly, we can't persuade Sessions, Vitter, and DeMint, and we sure can't as hell prevent them throwing a filibuster. So what's the point of dropping the eventual road to gaining citizenship? Even if that part were dropped, the worst of the worst Xenophobic SOBs would still call it amnesty and filibuster.

I don't know about anyone else on this forum, but I already consider myself American, I don't care what the hell anyone says about my status. And that means, one day, being able to fulfill and carry out the privileges that are entitled to being an American. But hey, that's just me. Well, there's always Canada for those willing to compromise who they really are.

Re: Defeatism
 

citizenhope, what's the 73 mean? I hope it's not the age you want to be at which you want Dream Act to pass...

Re: Defeatism
 

What 73 are you talking about?

Re: Defeatism
 

the 72 at the bottom

Re: Defeatism
 

McCain's age. He is a big fan.