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DAP Forums > DREAM Act > The Lounge

We will be fine - Page 3

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#21
01-27-2017, 05:50 PM
Senior Member
Joined in Dec 2010
165 posts
Dreamer3ooo
0 AP
If that leaked order is for real and they had already decided to go that route, there is no point or purpose in delaying it and coming out and saying that "they are working on something" and that they will "let us know in 4 weeks." If they ultimately just go ahead and sign that order, then what was the point of waiting? What would they have gained with the delay? That is what we have to consider. After thinking about it, I can't really come up with any benefit to making us wait 4 additional weeks and letting a month's worth of new DACA EAD's be approved before signing that order. All that would create is that many more protesters if they do decide to just go with the signed order. The only possible gain in making us wait and then signing that leaked order would be to make sure that our protest doesn't stack up with all of the other protests (women, healthcare, education, civil rights, etc.). But that argument doesn't hold much weight because regardless of when, the protests will come and the media will be all over it.

This leads me to believe that the reason why it wasn't signed is because they have not decided how they will use our situation to their advantage. I am under no illusion that they are "trying to figure something out that has a lot of heart" for us. But keep in mind that our situation has some great political capital for republicans. It would be stupid to squander that capital and get nothing in return except for satisfying the small percentage of angry white voters who are calling for DACA to end. Sessions and Bannon may not care, but there are plenty of republicans who understand what political capital is and how to use it.

Logically, the best way forward for everyone is to attach something like the DREAMAct to an enforcement spending bill. Those fancy new orders that Trump signed will need money to implement. The wall will cost billions, the 5000 CBP officers will need a salary similar to a cops salary, so multiply something like $50k (hypothetical estimate) and you have $250,000,000 a year. And that's not even taking into account "triple the ICE agents" and all the new immigration judges they need to hear these cases. Oh and it's not only salaries you have to consider, all of those agents are going to need gear and vehicles. The point is that the money for those orders isn't just lying around (what they can "divert" is limited) and the senate/house isn't just going to hand it over. This is where we come in, trade enforcement money for a "solution" for DREAMers and everybody wins. They get to implement their enforcement, build their wall, end DACA, and prove that Trump "has a big heart" all in one shot. This would also put Democrats in a tight spot, if they oppose the bill the GOP wins and the Dems look bad and get primaried. If the Dems are forced to vote for it, which I think enough will if DA is part of it, then the GOP gets credit for finally "doing something" about immigration. It's not comprehensive, it's piecemeal just like they want, and I wouldn't even mind if a path to citizenship isn't included. I just want to pay my bills and feed my family.

So my takeaway is that even though there are ignorant racists calling for our blood (Sessions and his merry men), there are also some pragmatic people even within the GOP that recognize this opportunity for what it is. We just have to hope that reason and logic win out over blind hate, a tall order I know. And then there is the wild card, Trump himself. I know that nobody trusts or believes him, myself included. But here's the thing, we don't have to believe him, as long as he believes himself. I think he believes himself when he says he has a big heart, and even though he is doing some significant damage to the country, he is doing it under the belief that it's because he cares. Maybe that can work out to our advantage, who knows.

This is all speculation of course, but speculation with applied logic helps me calm my nerves. We won't really know anything until the ink is dry on whatever he decides to sign, so while I am not advocating for blind optimism, I am also not falling into complete despair.
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#22
01-27-2017, 06:23 PM
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Joined in Sep 2016
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^Good post and a reminder of why I hate politics.
We, as dreamers, are being used as puppets... or collateral damage if you will, in this bigger scheme. The worst part is that the end result may benefit us, but does not include those that do not qualify under DACA (or the like) who also deserve some relief as well. However, speaking out about this when we are to receive some relief ourselves will put us at risk for not receiving anything at all.
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#23
01-27-2017, 06:28 PM
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isk84life
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We should all be looking to April. Thats when the house has their deadline for a vote on new appropriations.
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#24
01-27-2017, 07:01 PM
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606 posts
chopstix
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Quote:
Originally Posted by papi mango View Post
agree with your statement point but why would they deport 10 or 20?
Why? accidentally? forgot that they were not suppose to be?
For traffic ticket? for.. accidentally mistaken for another convict?
This stuff happened and will happen and it's happening now.
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#25
01-27-2017, 07:58 PM
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papi mango
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopstix View Post
Why? accidentally? forgot that they were not suppose to be?
For traffic ticket? for.. accidentally mistaken for another convict?
This stuff happened and will happen and it's happening now.
i don't know what to say but all i can say just relax and stay calm and positive.
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#26
01-30-2017, 11:56 PM
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Joined in Oct 2013
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Very good commentary,
I agree with you that is so strange that Trump has waited this long to rescind DACA. If he's going to do it he would have done it on day 1. Every day USCIS issues 800 work permits (new and renewals) for DACA. Why would Trump want all those work permits to be issued by his administration???

Its almost as if they are holding on to DACA because they are going to exchange it for something. Remember this dude is a businessman. My EAD expires on 09-09-17, but Im going to send my renewal packet tomorrow, F it I will risk the $500 if there is a chance I can get a new EAD for two more years.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamer3ooo View Post
If that leaked order is for real and they had already decided to go that route, there is no point or purpose in delaying it and coming out and saying that "they are working on something" and that they will "let us know in 4 weeks." If they ultimately just go ahead and sign that order, then what was the point of waiting? What would they have gained with the delay? That is what we have to consider. After thinking about it, I can't really come up with any benefit to making us wait 4 additional weeks and letting a month's worth of new DACA EAD's be approved before signing that order. All that would create is that many more protesters if they do decide to just go with the signed order. The only possible gain in making us wait and then signing that leaked order would be to make sure that our protest doesn't stack up with all of the other protests (women, healthcare, education, civil rights, etc.). But that argument doesn't hold much weight because regardless of when, the protests will come and the media will be all over it.

This leads me to believe that the reason why it wasn't signed is because they have not decided how they will use our situation to their advantage. I am under no illusion that they are "trying to figure something out that has a lot of heart" for us. But keep in mind that our situation has some great political capital for republicans. It would be stupid to squander that capital and get nothing in return except for satisfying the small percentage of angry white voters who are calling for DACA to end. Sessions and Bannon may not care, but there are plenty of republicans who understand what political capital is and how to use it.

Logically, the best way forward for everyone is to attach something like the DREAMAct to an enforcement spending bill. Those fancy new orders that Trump signed will need money to implement. The wall will cost billions, the 5000 CBP officers will need a salary similar to a cops salary, so multiply something like $50k (hypothetical estimate) and you have $250,000,000 a year. And that's not even taking into account "triple the ICE agents" and all the new immigration judges they need to hear these cases. Oh and it's not only salaries you have to consider, all of those agents are going to need gear and vehicles. The point is that the money for those orders isn't just lying around (what they can "divert" is limited) and the senate/house isn't just going to hand it over. This is where we come in, trade enforcement money for a "solution" for DREAMers and everybody wins. They get to implement their enforcement, build their wall, end DACA, and prove that Trump "has a big heart" all in one shot. This would also put Democrats in a tight spot, if they oppose the bill the GOP wins and the Dems look bad and get primaried. If the Dems are forced to vote for it, which I think enough will if DA is part of it, then the GOP gets credit for finally "doing something" about immigration. It's not comprehensive, it's piecemeal just like they want, and I wouldn't even mind if a path to citizenship isn't included. I just want to pay my bills and feed my family.

So my takeaway is that even though there are ignorant racists calling for our blood (Sessions and his merry men), there are also some pragmatic people even within the GOP that recognize this opportunity for what it is. We just have to hope that reason and logic win out over blind hate, a tall order I know. And then there is the wild card, Trump himself. I know that nobody trusts or believes him, myself included. But here's the thing, we don't have to believe him, as long as he believes himself. I think he believes himself when he says he has a big heart, and even though he is doing some significant damage to the country, he is doing it under the belief that it's because he cares. Maybe that can work out to our advantage, who knows.

This is all speculation of course, but speculation with applied logic helps me calm my nerves. We won't really know anything until the ink is dry on whatever he decides to sign, so while I am not advocating for blind optimism, I am also not falling into complete despair.
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#27
01-31-2017, 12:04 AM
Senior Member
From SoCal
Joined in Aug 2012
5,123 posts
g33k
0 AP
Quote:
Originally Posted by dgx21 View Post
Very good commentary,
I agree with you that is so strange that Trump has waited this long to rescind DACA. If he's going to do it he would have done it on day 1. Every day USCIS issues 800 work permits (new and renewals) for DACA. Why would Trump want all those work permits to be issued by his administration???

Its almost as if they are holding on to DACA because they are going to exchange it for something. Remember this dude is a businessman. My EAD expires on 09-09-17, but Im going to send my renewal packet tomorrow, F it I will risk the $500 if there is a chance I can get a new EAD for two more years.
He wants to keep the money of those people trying to get early renewals.
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#28
01-31-2017, 12:39 AM
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Joined in Jan 2017
61 posts
UndocumentedPapi
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He might let it 'die out' and force congress' hand to act on a long term solution quickly. That way Trump doesn't seem to 'betray' his far-right voting bloc.
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#29
01-31-2017, 07:36 AM
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113 posts
Sudo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopstix View Post
Question is.. is there a clear boundary between DACA and the other immigrants they are targeting? If they pick up DACA eligible/qualified dreamer from the street are they going to let him/her go or put him/her in detention center for months and get deported without due process?

I don't see a clear boundary between DACA and the other immigrants they're targeting. Just because WE know we have work permit/SSN/drivers license, that doesn't mean we are safe. Who knows what kind of memorandum went around behind our backs.

Until the news updates regarding DACA is out, I am not feeling comfortable.
but Life goes on.
We are safe, trump explicitly said we should not worry too much, we are terrific people, and he has something plan for us which will make us very happy.

The ones he is targeting are undocumented with past crimes.

The question in doubt is what will he do with our parents.
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#30
01-31-2017, 08:47 AM
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Joined in May 2006
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Ianus
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I hope many fellow dreamers are not being complacent about the President's actions just because he has not acted on DACA.
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