• Home
  • Today
  • Advocacy
  • Forum
Donate
  • login
  • register
Home

They need you!

Forum links

  • Recent changes
  • Member list
  • Search
  • Register
Search Forums
 
Advanced Search
Go to Page...

Resources

  • Do I qualify?
  • In-state tuition
  • FAQ
  • Ways to legalize
  • Feedback
  • Contact us

Join our list

National calendar of events

«  

July

  »
S M T W T F S
 
 
1
 
2
 
3
 
4
 
5
 
6
 
7
 
8
 
9
 
10
 
11
 
12
 
13
 
14
 
15
 
16
 
17
 
18
 
19
 
20
 
21
 
22
 
23
 
24
 
25
 
26
 
27
 
28
 
29
 
30
 
31
 
 
 
Sync with this calendar
DAP Forums > DREAM Act > The Lounge

Do You Think It's Kinda Our Fault CIR or DREAM Hasn't Passed Yet?

  • View
  • Post new reply
  • Thread tools
    Thread Tools
    Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
    Email this Page Email this Page
  • 1
  • 2
  • next ›
#1
03-20-2012, 02:15 PM
Senior Member
Joined in Apr 2006
186 posts
max
max
View Public Profile
Send a private message to max
Visit max's homepage!
Find all posts by max
0 AP
We are at least 10 million strong. With 1 million DREAM elegible youth leading the way. Our allies can only do so much. Congress and the media have to hear directly from us. United we would be unstoppable! Can you imagine what will happen if we all challenged the system? Challenged ICE? But the sad reality is that we are not united. We all compare our movement to the Cvil Rights movement, but I would like to argue that the African-American community had more in common between themselves than we do. The undocumented community have different backgrounds. For one thing about half of all undocumented came here legally and over stayed their Visas. Also the majority of us are Mexican but than we he have all the people from Latin America. Immigrants from all over the world make up the rest. Another factor is that we all have come to this country at different times. There are those that came right after the 1986 amnesty and have been here the longest. Then the ones that have arrived recently and those that fall somewhere in the middle. Than there are the pessimistic who believe absolutely that no immigration reform will ever happend and want nothing else but work and save as much money as possible because, one their going to be deported or two want a safety net for when the get old.

Do you guys think these differences play a roll in us not being as united as African-American community?

Another reason I think we are not united is because we have it to easy. Most of us are working and are getting payed enough to just get by. If not the youth than our parents are working.Time is valuable and once we get a good job we hold on to it like crazy. Working long hours and trying to save as much as possible knowing we could be deported. It seems that when the community is most united is when it feels threatened. When we actually see before our very own eyes the reality that some in the government want to deport us indiscriminately. In 2005 when the House passed the "Sensenbrenner Bill" the masses united. Even then the largest protest was about only 1 million. In my neighborhood I was shocked to see more Puerto Ricans in our march protesting than Latin Americans. And now recently with the Arizona law HB1070 again undocumented have taken to the streets to protest. But still not enough.

What will be the tipping point for people to finally act? Would we settle for a mediocre way of life?



Poll after poll say that the American people favor legalizing the immigrants already here. Yet, as usual, politicians are playing dirty politics and scream amnesty. If there is one thing we can take from the greats like Gandhi and MLK is that the oppressed have to show the world the hypocrisy of the law. Obama is right, he can't single handily pass a law. There is the Senate and there is the House. But when only small percentage of the undocumented community take action, like a couple thousand showing to a protest, Well... I just dont know anymore.
Last edited by max; 03-20-2012 at 07:11 PM..
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#2
03-20-2012, 03:38 PM
Senior Member
Joined in Nov 2010
1,204 posts
CB124
CB124
View Public Profile
Send a private message to CB124
Find all posts by CB124
20 AP
I think the large numbers are more of a hinderance than helpful.
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#3
03-20-2012, 05:01 PM
Senior Member
Joined in Sep 2010
231 posts
SaintD's Avatar
SaintD
SaintD
View Public Profile
Send a private message to SaintD
Find all posts by SaintD
0 AP
We are not the problem! People in congress and the senate who can see beyond the color of our skin and our place of birth. They hide behind their laws today, in the exact same way they did with their Jim Crow laws back in the 50's. We are as much criminals for wanting to be here and make a good life for our selves, as Rosa Parks was a criminal for sitting at the front of the bus!!!!!!!
__________________
App Sent- 11/19/2012
Biometrics (walk-in) done- 12/04/2012
RFE received 3/13/2013
RFE sent-4/29/2013
EAD/DACA approval- 5/15/2013
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#4
03-20-2012, 05:08 PM
Senior Member
From San Francisco, CA
Joined in Dec 2008
397 posts
jamesp
jamesp
View Public Profile
Send a private message to jamesp
Find all posts by jamesp
0 AP
ditto. I couldn't have said it better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintD View Post
We are not the problem! People in congress and the senate who can see beyond the color of our skin and our place of birth. They hide behind their laws today, in the exact same way they did with their Jim Crow laws back in the 50's. We are as much criminals for wanting to be here and make a good life for our selves, as Rosa Parks was a criminal for sitting at the front of the bus!!!!!!!
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#5
03-20-2012, 05:11 PM
Senior Member
Joined in Jan 2011
1,424 posts
tyler129
tyler129
View Public Profile
Send a private message to tyler129
Find all posts by tyler129
0 AP
of course, being proactive in the movement would have helped.

imagine if all of 1 million dreamers camped out in front of Congress like Occupy Wall St. You don't think it would have passed by now?

imagine if all of 12 million undocumented immigrants camped out in front of Congress. you really don't think CIR would have passed by now?
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#6
03-20-2012, 05:59 PM
Moderator
From Illinois/Florida
Joined in Jul 2009
2,219 posts
buckminsterfullerene's Avatar
buckminsterfullerene
buckminsterfullerene
View Public Profile
Send a private message to buckminsterfullerene
Find all posts by buckminsterfullerene
270 AP
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyler129 View Post
of course, being proactive in the movement would have helped.

imagine if all of 1 million dreamers camped out in front of Congress like Occupy Wall St. You don't think it would have passed by now?

imagine if all of 12 million undocumented immigrants camped out in front of Congress. you really don't think CIR would have passed by now?
12 million people is a greater number than the population of most states in the United States, that would be an epic statement, but the logistics behind it would make it next to impossible to pull off, its just such a massive number.

I think the issue is that the are looking at the numbers, and numbers do not say anything about the people, they need more stories, they need to see who we are and what we do.

It is easier to say no to 1 million people than it is to say no to someone whose story they know and whose hardships they are familiar with.

Its not our fault CIR or DA did not pass, instead, its the activism and bringing forth our stories that we even managed to get the DA voted on last semester and win the house for the first time, we have not been this close, only 5 votes and it would have been a reality. Our stories have also been the biggest push in causing changes in legislation to go in our favor. States that pass anti-immigration laws observe economic hardship due to a story like the one of a 6 year old afraid to go to school because they are afraid of being discriminated against, and you start seeing states pushing for more pro-immigration laws and increasing international support toward those states.

Having more people active will of course help, and we are seeing a change in the direction that ICE is taking, unfortunately, they seem to be targeting the communities that they know will be less likely to talk, and the groups that are going to be in greatest risk (those whose asylum petition failed, a few have been deported, and some have been killed as a result).

What we need to do is move this issue away from being a political issue, which is how politicians treat it, and into a civil rights or human rights issue, and I think considering the people's lives are in play it can be a human rights issue, and the laws that are passing discriminating against people based on how they look is a civil rights issue.
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#7
03-20-2012, 06:08 PM
Senior Member
Joined in Feb 2012
429 posts
kingsam73's Avatar
kingsam73
kingsam73
View Public Profile
Send a private message to kingsam73
Find all posts by kingsam73
0 AP
KONY 2012!...I mean...DA 2012!, or 2013 or 2014 works fine too.....
__________________
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds. -- Albert Einstein
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#8
03-20-2012, 06:09 PM
Moderator
From Illinois/Florida
Joined in Jul 2009
2,219 posts
buckminsterfullerene's Avatar
buckminsterfullerene
buckminsterfullerene
View Public Profile
Send a private message to buckminsterfullerene
Find all posts by buckminsterfullerene
270 AP
Just about a month ago I was in a meeting with community members representing the black community, their concerns where a bit different, but not too alien to what we have experienced or could experience if the current policies are enacted.

They were pretty shocked when they heard some of the similarities, and I was pretty interested in the fact that they had not seen it coming, since they invited us to this space, but I reason it as the elephant in the room. People know that it exists, but no one talks about it, they ignore its existence and forget about it.

One of the biggest social concerns that they displayed dealt with identity and heritage. Many came from families that where brought here as slaves and dedicated a long portion of their discussion talking about how they could not trace their background further than a couple generations, their names had been taken away and they were given new names by slave masters, and their grandparents did not tell them their stories for the fear of bringing back old scars.

Well, there is even similarities in what they are facing now and what we could face in the future as a result of policies enacted today. A few weeks ago, I heard the story of a father, the breadwinner for his family, who got deported. His wife, a US Citizen could not take care of their four children, she could not make enough, and a court ordered the children to be taken from her and adopted. Those children will be unable to know of their roots, of their heritage, and when they find out they where adopted, they will grow up wondering why their parents gave them away not know they were taken by the government.

When I told this story in a different meeting that took place after the screening of Frontline: Lost In Detention at the University of Chicago, one of the people attending worked with DCF, and tried to justify the actions as being done in the best interest of the children. That would not have taken place if the father had not been treated as a criminal for driving without a license.

That is just one similarity that I can come up with right now, one elephant in the room that needs exposing, one of very many.
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#9
03-20-2012, 07:05 PM
Senior Member
Joined in Apr 2006
186 posts
max
max
View Public Profile
Send a private message to max
Visit max's homepage!
Find all posts by max
0 AP
Quote:
Originally Posted by CB124 View Post
I think the large numbers are more of a hinderance than helpful.
If that is the case than we are in trouble. Isn't that part of the hole argument? In every single news report they always say "12 to 20 million illegal immigrant in this country!" I guess it's a sad reality in social movements only very few become active.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintD View Post
We are not the problem! People in congress and the senate who can see beyond the color of our skin and our place of birth. They hide behind their laws today, in the exact same way they did with their Jim Crow laws back in the 50's. We are as much criminals for wanting to be here and make a good life for our selves, as Rosa Parks was a criminal for sitting at the front of the bus!!!!!!!
You are right about Rosa Parks, but then her community acted on that situation. Not only a few did. The action was so big that the law was overturned. Again it was because of Action.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tyler129 View Post
of course, being proactive in the movement would have helped.

imagine if all of 1 million dreamers camped out in front of Congress like Occupy Wall St. You don't think it would have passed by now?

imagine if all of 12 million undocumented immigrants camped out in front of Congress. you really don't think CIR would have passed by now?
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckminsterfullerene View Post
12 million people is a greater number than the population of most states in the United States, that would be an epic statement, but the logistics behind it would make it next to impossible to pull off, its just such a massive number.

I think the issue is that the are looking at the numbers, and numbers do not say anything about the people, they need more stories, they need to see who we are and what we do.

It is easier to say no to 1 million people than it is to say no to someone whose story they know and whose hardships they are familiar with.
I know it's not just about huge ass marches. Even though you have to admit it sounds pretty bad ass when a news anchors say "1 million march". I don't think they will say "no" to 1 million people standing at their door steps. It helps to show how big and massive the problem really is. More stories? Yeah that's important too, and I think it's impressive to see so many undocumented coming out and telling their stories. But a point will come soon when we will stall in the movement with just story telling. Look, I stood in front of a Senator and told my story and that didn't change his mind. I stood in front of another Senator's secretary and told my story. Again that didn't do jack shit. I'm sorry but I can't stop the feeling I get that at the end of the day just story telling will only get us pity from someone else. And congressman don't operate on feelings of others. That is the reality. Some do but they are rare.


We have to convince them by using shame. Exposing them to their lies. Challenge the system. Not only by a 1 million immigrant march. The possibilities are infinite. How about going to ICE offices and see if they really can deport all us at the same time? That will shut Republicans mouths right away. When ICE starts to turn "illegals" away. How about that for a news headline. How about a real work boycott? How about a number of DREAMers equal to the number of student Visas issued each year show up to a Washington's embassy? Again the main thing is to expose their hypocrisy. And yes the turn out will have to be huge, because when the opposition say "they will self deport" they don't mean only a couple thousand.
Last edited by max; 03-20-2012 at 07:08 PM..
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
#10
03-20-2012, 08:42 PM
Senior Member
From texas
Joined in Jan 2010
586 posts
NoWhereToRun's Avatar
NoWhereToRun
NoWhereToRun
View Public Profile
Send a private message to NoWhereToRun
Find all posts by NoWhereToRun
0 AP
I am planning on leaving in June. at the moment i have my fingers crossed and hoping some kind of comprehensive immigration reform comes along. so i am going along and just corresponding with lawyers hoping that there is a loophole. the last one i dealt with he was honest and told me straightforward that there was no hope in my case and not to retain a lawyer to open the case. well long story short... i asked if it was convenient for me to stay illegal hoping for some sort of cir in near future. his answer was that currently there is no hope mainly due to politics. we are the pawn in the game of chess or the puppets. relieved to hear the truth, depressed that there is no hope, and pissed at OBAMA.
  • Reply With Quote
Post your reply or quote more messages.
  • 1
  • 2
  • next ›


« Previous Thread | Next Thread »


Contact Us - DREAM Act Portal - Archive - Top
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.